Talking run, swim, and bike with Anya Culling and Emma Pallant-Browne
Ahead of this weekend's London stop of the T100 Triathlon World Tour, we caught up with British running sensation Anya Culling who will be tackling what will be just her second triathlon. Anya joined 22x Ironman 70.3 Champ, Emma Pallant-Browne for a chat, discussing elite running, racing at ‘home’, making the switch to triathlon, and much more.
Anya, take us back to the beginning. How did you get into running?
The start of my running journey originates from the COVID lockdown. I started running during that time simply for my mental health, and I really enjoyed the peace and quiet of an hour a day outdoors. I loved how running made me feel so much, and the confidence it gave me because I was doing things that I never thought I could.
2019 was my first marathon in London. I hadn't trained at all for it and finished in 4 hrs 34 mins. Fast forward to 2022, post-lockdown, and I ran a 2.36, pretty much knocking 2 hours off my original time. I then qualified to represent England and ran a 2.34 in London.
Wow! Shaving 2 hours off your original marathon time is incredibly impressive. What initially kept you motivated to keep running after your first marathon in 2019?
When I started running, I was obsessed with the feeling of doing something that I previously thought I couldn’t do. Getting better week after week and seeing my progression was really motivating. Coming out of the COVID lockdown, I associated running with being a really social sport. I then got a coach and just continued to fall in love with the sport.
For both of you, what’s your favorite run distance?
Emma:
At the moment I’d say half marathon. I’ve done a lot of them here in South Africa as they are ideal training distance - particularly for my Sunday long run.
I’d love to have a go at the marathon distance. As a runner going into triathlon, I thought it’d just be for a couple of races while I got over my injury, and then I got hooked, and now I am actually running faster times for my 10k and half marathon than when I was a runner, so I definitely think the training is so good for your body and it's almost like you don’t have to choose anymore.
I ran the half marathon qualifying standard for Worlds, but the timings didn’t work out to do that race, I think I’d like to do the marathon - that’s a big goal for me at some point, time-wise.
Anya:
For me, it’s the marathon. It’s where I started.
I think this could translate well to longer distance triathlon eventually, due to my endurance. I’m definitely built for endurance versus having that top-end speed.
Let’s talk about the swim. Anya, when did you first learn to swim, and what has your relationship been with swimming to date?
I learnt to swim as a child. But I think there’s learning to swim, and then there’s racing. I still have quite a bit of work to do with the swim, when thinking about triathlon. Although, I’m swimming a few times a week regularly now and I am just loving seeing my progression again.
It wasn’t until I got my FORM goggles that I could actually see my splits. I had a watch, but couldn’t get my splits from that, and certainly not instantly, in my eye. Before, I wasn’t aware of my progression when I was swimming, until I had my FORM goggles. They are proving really helpful for my swimming at the moment.
Emma, we know you initially used swimming as a way to rehab an injury - how did you turn your swimming into a triathlon career?
I discovered triathlon through being injured while running - I wanted an extra goal, and a different challenge, and swimming was what gave me this new challenge.
2010 was when I had my surgery, and was swimming simply for rehab purposes. 2012 was then when I really committed to triathlon and had a goal with my rehab, to fill in that gap, before I could go back to full-time running.
I did an off-road triathlon to start, which was mostly to see if I liked it or not. Then after, I was like, OK, I enjoy this, and got a coach, I borrowed her bike and wetsuit, and got bumped into the elite wave of the London triathlon, and that’s where I thought I can’t come last here. All I wanted was not to come last.
…how did it go?
I had the shock of my life.
The swim in the docks was supposed to be simple, but I went off course and came out last. On the bike, I didn’t know how to draft, but at least when I got on to the run I was back in my element. Overall, it was such a hard day, the concept of in-race nutrition was bizarre to me, but I really enjoyed it.
It was definitely a baptism of fire!
It’s certainly not the first time we’ve heard triathlon described that way! What kept you hooked?
It was refreshing having this challenge because as a runner I was always someone who went out hard and would feel the pain of running hard early on. I’d ran from such a young age that I was time-driven and always thought, OK, if I can reach my top speed as fast as possible then all I have to do is suffer through that pain and hang on for as long as possible. Whereas with triathlon I was always at the back, trying to come through the pack.
I wish I’d started off with FORM goggles, as it would have been very helpful to see my progress. The first 6 months when I started open water swimming compared to my 5th race was a massive difference from where I was to where I got to. It would have been great to understand what I was doing and how my training was leading to these improvements back then.
Anya, how did the idea of triathlon come to you, and what got you interested in it?
I think it was the idea of making myself uncomfortable again. Competing in sports you start to enjoy that pain Emma mentioned, and I wanted to try my hand at triathlon to test myself at something new. I have loved it, as I am seeing that progression again. Instead of getting disheartened by not being good at something, or being at peak fitness all the time, I’ve always enjoyed taking a step back and watching myself build.
It’s that same mindset I had with my running, that I am taking into triathlon. Tackling something I thought I couldn’t do. I am ready to be a beginner again, I’m ready to push myself. I know what hard work is like, and how much work I will have to put into it. I’m excited!
We’re excited for you! Speaking of which, Emma, with the T100 Tour this year, how have you found having the race series to focus on?
I think it’s been awesome. When I think back to running, you’d have the big Diamond League events, and races series’ that you know when you turn up you’re going to be racing the top athletes in the world regularly.
I think triathlon missed this in the past, because there are so many races out there that athletes could choose from, and therefore the competition was scattered, or athletes would be focusing on races that clashed on the calendar, which meant you weren’t often getting all the best athletes meeting together, regularly.
Whereas now, racing against the best, it’s going to keep boosting the level of competition. The really exciting thing has been that when you look at the results, we have had three different winners across women’s and men’s T100 races. It shows there’s not a clear pecking order, different courses have a big difference. It's exciting racing, for sure!
We totally agree, and as spectators too, it doesn’t get much better than watching these races play out. Anya, how are you feeling ahead of your first T100 race in London?
From someone watching, knowing who to watch out for in each race, and seeing the storylines unfold with rivalries forming across the swim, bike, and run makes it super interesting to follow and watch. You really get behind the athletes and their performances.
As for me, London races definitely hold a big place in my heart.
I am really looking forward to racing at home and knowing where I am. I have already swam in the Royal Victoria Docks, and pretty much recce’d all of the bike course, so it’s a great one for my first T100 race, and won’t be my last one!
Home races can’t be beaten! Emma, how do you feel about racing in your home country, too?
I agree! I was back in London in February doing a 10k running race, and it certainly gave me an appreciation of racing at ‘home’. Although I have been based in South Africa for a while now, I do love racing at home, in London, because it’s where I am from, and it’s where all my family is. The fact that everyone came up for that race, feels even more of a big deal now I am not living there.
Even simple things, like knowing the course, the underground, and where to eat, mean I can just focus on the race. You’re more relaxed about everything else. I definitely think home advantage is a big thing.
Anya, over to you. Do you see triathlon as a sport you’re looking to switch to full-time?
At present, I am going with the flow. I am at the point with marathon running where I am confident with what I am doing, I know it’s going to hurt, and I know how to really push myself.
With triathlon, because I am still at the early stages of my triathlon career I have so much still to learn, so I can’t give it my all yet, because I just don’t have the confidence. That being said, I do see myself fully moving over to triathlon at some point because it’s better for your body. There’s more longevity in the sport, and I really enjoy the variety of training across the three disciplines.
For now, I plan to get another quick marathon under my belt, but also keep up my swimming and cycling on the side, with the plan being to dip my toes more and more into triathlon.
That’s awesome to hear. Emma, in your career have you found any crossover between swim and run training?
Yes, even amongst runners I know like Eilish McColgan use cross-training so much as part of their training, so I think in general if you work in the right zones that fitness is fitness, and if you can do easy workouts in a different activity your body can go even faster in your main sport.
In terms of my swim sessions. I feel that swimming helped me run better technically just because I saw that if I put a lot of work into my efficiency through the water, how much quicker I can then go using less effort.
Seeing my heart rate on my FORM goggles, you can see when you’re being sloppy and can correlate time and heart rate. I know what numbers should be, and if one is way off then I know I need to sharpen up my technique. I found this is very similar with my running too.
Last but certainly not least - we’d love to hear what’s the one piece of advice you’d both give to runners taking on a triathlon.
Emma:
First of all, you don’t have to pick between doing one or the other. Just because you’re going to be doing less running through a triathlon build doesn’t mean you’re going to be a slower runner. The two sports and multiple disciplines combine super nicely.
Yes, you do have to learn the efficiency of swimming and biking, so a) you don’t get injured, and b) your body gets stronger and healthier, but I do think overall triathlon does create a stronger body so you might actually find you’re not going from a ‘runner’, you’re actually becoming a stronger runner, and a triathlete at the same time.
The next thing would be nutrition. Especially if you’re doing the longer triathlons, then you really need to make sure you fuel well. It might feel a bit weird at first, as you will be eating a lot more, certainly in and between sessions, but that helps you to fuel well in competition, and recover more.
Anya:
For me, I’d recommend training with heart rate. Running is so much about pace, as a metric, but I’m putting more effort into my swimming and cycling because my body is not used to training over all three disciplines, so as a baseline, making sure I am in the right heart rate zones helps me get the most out of my training.
I’ve enjoyed taking things back to basics, focusing on heart rate, and taking it from there.
Thanks so much, Anya and Emma. It goes without saying we’ll be tuned in, watching and cheering for you this weekend in London. We wish you both all the best!
Check out Anya and Emma’s social channels below and follow along.
Emma Pallant-Browne
